01. Did you always aim for animation as a professional career or you come from other fields? If that is the case, which one it was and did you get to work on it and then you switched?

No, I come from a Fine Art background. I studied Fine Art at universities in the UK and finally completing a Masters Degree at Rutgers University in the US. I´ve taught extensively, initially having taught Art & Design but gradually becoming more interested in Filmmaking and Animation while teaching at colleges in London where I met Joanna in 1983. I studied Painting and Art History then became a conceptual artist living and working in New York, and finally I became interested in film, particularly documentary and Surrealist Cinema. I taught Art & Design, then Film and Animation Production for over 25 years at Universities in the UK . I finished teaching in 2002 while Course Director in Film and Animation production at the University of Wales Newport.


02. How did Beryl Productions start off? How everything started over?

I first collaborated with Joanna on "Girls Night Out" whilst teaching basic animation on the Graphic Design degree course at Middlesex University. This film introduced the character of Beryl to audiences and successfully launched Joanna´s career as a world class animator. From then on we worked very closely together, I wrote and produced the next Beryl film "Body Beautiful" and produced "Wife of Bath" which got an Oscar nomination and won three Emmys.

We set up Beryl Productions in 1987 to develop and build on the success of "Girls Night Out" and to produce ads and further commissions from TV companies.

Over the last twenty years we´ve produced a range of our own short films commissions and ads.
The company´s name BERYL comes from the central character of these films.

We started doing ads as a means of establishing our studio. The first ad was for an American sweet called Nips which Joanna and I produced alone she drew it- I coloured it! We´ve produced over 100 ads since then which include the Charmin toilet paper range, Whiskas cat food and United Airlines. Ads are our bread and butter, without them we wouldn´t have a studio and we couldn´t make our own films.

In our studio we´ve got have a more or less permanent core staff of about 8 and we´re based in studios in Cardiff, Wales. We use mainly freelance staff as and when required, and these might be based in Wales the UK or Europe. I suppose you´d describe what we do in general as traditional 2D drawn character animation.


03. How did you get to know animation and why did you choose it as media?

I moved into the world of animation from film largely because of teaching and working with Joanna, and mainly because it´s very close, in many respects, to Fine Art. For me Animation is the perfect synthesis of Art, Film language and Literature. After being exposed to a vast range of animated films I soon realised that in animation one could combine concepts and techniques from many different spheres and media - in my own case film making, sound and, of course, developing personal ideas in scripts.

For me animation embodies so many different forms of expression .When I used to teach I focussed mainly on the fundamentals - original concepts, closely followed by the ability to explore and experiment without fear, in open and unrestricted ways using a wide frame of historical and contemporary reference points. This is what really interests me in animation terms - not the technique especially, but being able to express a combination of socio political ideas, to bridge and exploit different media and to explore universal and personal themes. In terms of design and animation technique, coming from Fine Art, I´m still intensely involved and critical of the aesthetics of the images in our films. I´m Joanna´s biggest critic, always trying to get her to extend the dynamics of her drawing spatially and pictorially, but keeping the fluidity and liveliness of her line and exploring her imagination.


04. We know you write the scripts for Beryl's movies, how important, as far as you're concerned, as you think is the script in a movie?

It depends - there are many animated films - probably the majority- which don´t have any dialogue scripts but which are exceptional pieces of art.. "Britannia" in my view is Joanna´s masterpiece but it doesn´t have a dialogue script as such - it´s the strength and power of the overall concept which carries the film and the exceptional brilliance of the drawn animation & characterisation.

Sometimes the spoken work can be a barrier to expression and comprehension, other times it can combine with the visuals to create something of immense power and emotional intensity. Some films which I´ve been really impressed with in terms of the spoken word and the imagery are Chris Shepard´s film "Who I am and what I want" "Ryan" by Chris Landreth "Still life with Dogs" by Paul Fierlinger, "Sawney Beane" by Elizabeth Hobbs. I´m interested in dialogue, the drama of actual, overheard conversations and especially the format of diary as an expressive vehicle, therefore I tend to write dialogue heavy scripts. It´s virtually impossible to deal with diary in animation or film without using the written or spoken word. I´m heavily influenced by documentary interviewing techniques interwoven with the characters own personal thoughts and reactions to unfolding events or past experiences. I like to play with the actual process of filmmaking, to move in and out of different representations of realities, to surprise audiences.

I think the video camera has been an incredibly liberating and enabling tool of expression and I use it constantly in the creative process and lately in the content of our films.


05. And from the starting point till the end of the production process, how many changes does the script suffer?

There were about 26 drafts of the script for Family Ties and then some minor changes towards the end of production because some of the actual animation was changed. Also because we don´t always record the final voice tracks until the end, sometimes the actors improvise the dialogue and we might want to use some of what they do because it´s so good. The problem then is that we might have to do extra animation to cope with the extra dialogue, which is not a good idea when you are trying to finish the film to a deadline.


06. How do you approach to a character like Beryl? Where do you look for inspiration for the developing of a character like her? And on top of all this, when you face the creation of a new character, do you follow any method, is all inspiration or a little bit of both?

People often ask me how do you write about a female character like Beryl when after all you are a man! It is likely that the character of Beryl is based on characters from both our experiences - a composite woman built up from experience and knowledge of a variety of older women with similar personalities that Joanna and I were in frequent contact with as we grew up. These women were very warm, popular and gregarious figures, much loved by everybody with a generosity of spirit and an unique ability to triumph over adversity when faced with problematic and stressful situations - ordinary women struggling but uncomplaining, battling against difficult circumstances to provide stability and security for their family and friends. We´ve both always identified with the underdog, the exploited or the politically unrepresented and Beryl embodies this, as well as other more overtly dramatic qualities imposed on her by me. There is a tradition in British cinema of these types of women who were brilliant character actresses such actresses as Irene Handel. Dandy Nichols, Katherine Harrison. and lately Allison Steadman. It was combination of all these influences which undoubtedly provoked the genesis of Beryl.

Most of the other characters in the Beryl films come from my own observations in real life situations, for example Mandy the bride in Family Ties was developed from meeting a really outrageous and loud woman who we met while trying to buy a second hand car from her husband who was himself a "shady character" and who became the bridegroom in Family Ties. Other characters I derived from experiences with my own family over the years. I usually use acute observation as the basis for all the characters and then add qualities which I glean from a variety of other sources and experiences.

Background histories to each of the characters are really important to me, the character profiles that I write are very detailed and involved and sometimes they become more interesting than the actual narrative! I also love to research very heavily I enjoy delving into peoples lives and exploring their idiosyncrasies, their past histories and I love listening to their anecdotes. I think this is where documentary film influences me. With the possible exception of Beryl most of my characters tend toward the hysterical and the melodramatic. Interpersonal conflicts are really important elements in my scripts which invariably deal with people overreacting, losing control, being frustrated or taking pessimistic viewpoints - hope is a dead end street sums up many of the characters attitudes.


07. In the same way, there is any methodology you follow for your creative process? For you, which one is your favorite moment of this process?

Initially Joanna and I talk endlessly about themes for the films, usually from Beryl´s perspective. A dominating theme for the whole of the Beryl series is of rebirth - renaissance, of Beryl rediscovering ambitions that she was unable to fulfil in her youth. It´s a situation that many older women find themselves in now that their families have grown up. We identify many ideas initially then concentrate on a few, in this instance it is the combination of Beryl´s Dreams, past recollections and her reawakened ambitions to become a creative individual.

Because the format is diary I completely assume the persona of Beryl and I work on individual script ideas by talking directly to a video camera and recording it. In this way I establish the framework for the idea from Beryl´s overall perspective. Sometimes she´s talking about past experiences , other times she´s outlining her future plans or articulating her anxieties.

The overall narrative is established by deciding on a series of classic incidents or events which she will become involved in, then the actual exposition of those events, point of view of the camera or Beryl talking directly to camera. Because the current ideas are episodic I have to make sure that there are continuous links which follow the narrative from one film to the next. This becomes the overall structure for the scripts, within which I make frequent reference to the knowledge of film history and language that Beryl is gradually acquiring through her studies and actual experience. I then transcribe my video diary notes into written scripts , refining them at all stages and of course involving Joanna intimately because she´s the one that has to translate these script ideas visually into character designs, storyboards, a complete animatic and ultimately the animation itself.

My favourite moments in the process are numerous. When I think that the overall structure and narrative feels right it gives me a real buzz. I love seeing the characters I´ve described in writing come to life through Joanna´s drawings. I love seeing Jo´s initial rough movement tests, when I actually see the characters in a sense living for the first time.. it´s magical.

She uses my character profiles to establish the look of the individual characters and sometimes I help out with the storyboard frames, because I have very definite ideas about viewpoint or space.
I love hearing what I´ve written being performed and developed by actors sometimes they are so brilliant and they bring new dimensions and nuances to the characters.

Wow I wish I could act!

Lastly, putting the film before an audience for the fist time - it´s incredibly nerve wracking but if the audience response is really good the feeling of achievement is fantastic for both of us.


08. Which ones are your referents in literature, painting or music?

In the film there are specific references to Films & Film makers ie Vertov, Leni Riefenstahl. Hal Ashby. Cecil Hepworth and of course to Joanna´s major influences in Painting and drawing eg. Rubens, Daumier, Toulouse Latrec. Velazquez.

Lately I´ve been re reading Tom Wolfe´s "Bonfire of the Vanities" which is a fantastically vivid and richly decorative study of the highs and lows of Manhattan life in the late 80´s. Purely as an exercise in characterisation and detail it is enthralling and brilliant. When I was a student I was a voracious reader I read everybody - Dickens, Hemmingway, Balzac, Camus, Steinbeck, Orwell,Huxley - a lot of French and American writers.

Musically my tastes are very catholic. I´m into very different sorts of music from the impressionist music of Debussy, Ravel, Satie to the Bepop of Charlie Parker and Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davies I love the Blues and Soul - people like Buddy Guy, BBKing. John Mayer, Joe Walsh, Roy Buchanan,Aretha Franklyn. I like Flamenco, Fado. Salsa, Latin Rock, Bob Dylan the big classic standards like"Autumn Leaves" or singers like Billy Holliday. I also like much contemporary music especially music that comes from different roots or combines unlikely musical forms., that´s why in our film I´m not afraid to combine and use very different sorts of music depending on the mood or atmosphere we want to evoke. When I lived in New York I played drums [badly] in a rock group called the Artweisers!


09. Pick one: Writing or producing?

I can´t separate the two. Realising what I´ve written through the process of production is like publishing a book it´s great, but on the other hand being in overall control of a production and delivering a highly professional and critically acclaimed film gives me enormous satisfaction.


10. Getting in to the business, what kind of problems do you have to deal with at the time of finding financing?

Like I said it´s not a good time for finding money to make short animated films. 20 years ago Channel 4 UK and S4C would fall over themselves to commission your films , but things have changed now. All funders seem to want now are either Series especially for children, or Features which will ultimately make them a lot of money it´s very depressing really. Family Ties was 50% financed by ourselves with the money we made out of doing TV ads.


11. What kind of goals do you set out when you have a new project? Do you pretend just amuse the crowd or you look more for making them think?

Obviously I want the scripts to function on many levels, so I try and build layers of meaning into them, whether they are social, political or cultural. We try to be accessible and appeal to a broad audience base and naturally we hope to surprise them and open up their minds to new possibilities as well as entertaining them.


12. As audience, are you demanding or critic?

We are both perfectionists and incredibly critical throughout the pre and production stages and we constantly challenge what we do. This means that we spend too long on the production side of things because we continuously refine what we do. This drives other members of the production team crazy, especially the editor, the compositor and sometimes the actors. We can see many faults in Family Ties, but now we have to accept that’s it’s done now and we focus all our creative efforts on the next film.


13. Name; in your opinion, three exceptional animation artists? (Sorry, Joanna is not a valid answer)

This is really difficult – I can’t - here are a few that stand out: Bill Plympton. Raymund Krumme. Tim Hope. Susan Piitt. Michaela Pavlatova. Karen Kelly. Caoroline Leaf. Wendy Tillby. Jan Svankmajer. Marc Craste. Mark Baker.


14. Joanna and you team up really well. How is to work with her?

Because we have worked together for so long - over 24 years - we know each others strengths and weaknesses and we are both incredibly critical. As you already know, I met Joanna initially while teaching her drawing so I’m her strongest critic in drawing terms. I force her to be as extreme as possible with the exaggerations [ like her idol Tex Avery] , the use of pictorial space and the view points. I also love to research and constantly nag Joanna to do much more visual and background reference. We bring very different qualities to our films – there is absolutely nothing I can teach Joanna about animation technique or characterisation - her brilliance is self evident. What Jo brings to the character designs though, which I can’t, is the way characters react and interact, their particular body language, their facial expressions but above all their physical movements which take my mere written descriptive prose much further and really define the individual identity and personality of the characters.

Joanna thinks in black and white, I always see things as a colourist.

I love to develop concepts and live in my imagination. I believe that your most powerful dreams can form part of your consciousness in the same way as your actual experiences. Joanna is very practical and absolutely adores the physical act of drawing and the magic of movement itself. In these ways we complement each other and it seems to work!!


15. Talking about "Family Ties", did you ever expect the great success that is having? What makes you think; besides Joannas talent, of course, that keeps the audience glued to the screen during your movie? Which other ingredients are involved in this recipe?

We never expected the success we’ve had with the film, we had no idea how audiences would view it until we went to Annecy in 2006.

I think Family Ties above all else is multi layered – there are strands in the film which make it accessible to many different audiences, - those who know a lot about film history and others who identify solely with the characters and with the narrative. It touches upon universal themes which everybody can identify with- marriage, human relationships, renaissance, ambition, dreams, disasters. I think above all else I’m pleased that audiences seem to accept the way the film moves in and out of a sort of naturalism into the surreal world of Beryl’s imagination and psyche. Also Beryl is a totally un glamorous anti heroine – the wrong age, the wrong shape, "ordinary" but with terrific optimism and motivation. She’s rediscovered things she missed out on in her youth and she’s determined to exploit her potential as a creative individual – many older women in the audiences identify with this and applaud it.


16. The music chosen during for the final credits, it just fits in perfect. Who is the responsible for the soundtracks at Beryl?

I did all the F/X sound on FT and directed the voice over recordings. We worked very closely with Tino Orts from Valencia who composed the original music within the film.

The end credit music was chosen at the very last moment because I wanted to do something memorable and quite surreal to extend the atmosphere of the film. I chose from a range of standard classic songs which I felt would evoke a certain impressionistic quality. One of them was Nat King Cole’s "Unforgettable" which was quite ironic but which we could not afford [the publishers wanted 15,000.00 euros for 30 seconds] "The Shadow of your Smile" for me did everything- it complemented the image of a naked Beryl dancing with Digger the dog, it’s a fantastically memorable melody which audiences whistle as they leave the cinemas, and the quality of the recording is quite evocative and bizarre. I recorded my brother, Brian, playing it on his very old Yamaha organ in his bedroom. For me it captures the same kind of atmosphere as in old faded ballrooms in deteriorating seaside resorts in Britain. I’ve only just learnt from a friend in New Jersey that " The Shadow of your Smile" it is the most used piece of music in most Italian American weddings in New York and New Jersey!!


17. Could you please, tell us any anecdote from the production of "Family Ties"?

Mandy, the bride in “Dreams & Desires - Family Ties" was based on a woman we both met when we were trying to buy a car off her husband. One evening, to negotiate the deal, we were invited into her front living room which was in the middle of a "Gold Party" – all these women were sitting around drinking Bloody Mary’s. They were being sold cheap gold jewellery – [it’s called Bling. in the UK]. by the woman – it’s a well known con – you invite your friends around and then you try and sell them things like sex toys or gold for profit. In the hallway of the house were stacked crates of imported Spanish beer and cigarettes obviously illegally imported and sold by her husband on the black market. He was called Terry. and he drove an old, flashy white Mercedes which we had come to buy. He became Terry the Groom in Family Ties. They had one of those small, pampered poodle dogs too, with a knitted coat on it and a rhinestone collar. I wrote some of the profiles for Family Ties based on these two and Joanna designed the characters with these two in mind but embellished somewhat. Mandy became highly volatile and into rubber and latex , Terry became uptight, aggressive and shady and the dog became Digger, Mandy’s highly pampered, excitable and incontinent dog.

We bought the white Mercedes from them – it fell apart 2 months later!

Digger the Dog

We auditioned three dogs for "Barkover" work in FT. One of them "Frank" whose owner assured us was fantastic, froze completely in the audition. Another one failed to show up and finally Pepi did a faultless audition performing everything on cue to perfection. Pepi’s owner , a contemporary dance instructor, showed Joanna how to waltz, with Pepi looking on. We videod it and Jo used it as reference for the animation of the end dance credit sequence.


18. And, any tip from your next project?

Our next film in the Dreams & Desiers series is called Beverly Thrills" In this film we’re introduced to Beverly, Beryl’s younger sister who is referred to in "Family Ties" and who lives in L.A. She is into taxidermitry, embalming and cryogenics. Beverley invites Beryl to visit her in LA to be introduced to her latest "dream lover" – Jesus, a Cuban plastic surgeon who also runs a funeral Limo service called "Last Chance Saloons" He’s the latest in a long line of potential husbands.

We’re continuing the video diary format but we delve much deeper into Beryl’s family background and history. We’ve given ourselves licence to go outside the diary format at times especially when Beryl reminisces about growing up with her sister who is vastly more eccentric than Beryl.

We had the pleasure of seeing our lead actress Menna Trussler, who plays Beryl in "Family Ties" and "Body Beautiful", perform a one woman theatre show which was a complete monologue and quite brilliant. We want to exploit Menna’s ability to perform continuous monologue as video diary but cutting away frequently to images from Beryl’s childhood which she’s describing.


19. Any piece of advice, from you, for those who are thinking about getting into the short animation movies business?

Don’t – people only want to fund Features or kids series – it’s incredibly difficult to get funding for short animated films. No no - I’m only joking - if you have the passion, determination and imagination for animation you will find the money to make your films – keep your ideas simple but original – if you can’t sum up the essence of the idea in a couple of lines it probably won’t work.

There’s nothing greater than experiencing the buzz you get from putting your film in front of audiences all over the world – it’s fantastic - maybe better than sex or drugs.


20. We know you like Spain a lot. Despite the topics, what do you like the most from our country?

Ever since I was very young I wanted to be Spanish- I even signed my name Les Juan Molinos! I identified with the intensity of Spain’s cultural forms, painting, music, dance, literature it was all so much more passionate than what we had in grey, uptight Britain.

When I went to school I took Spanish as a subject and was truly inspired by my teacher who was a fantastically talented and witty author and playwright called Gwyn Thomas. He’d studied Spanish in Madrid University before the Civil War and told us enthralling stories about hanging out in Madrid cafés with the likes of Lorca and Bunuel. Can you imagine the effect that had on me – it was truly inspirational.

Before I went to university, I worked in Wales with a refugee, an ex Republican soldier called Paco who told me endless stories about the whole tragedy of the aftermath of the civil war. In Wales I met Welsh coal miners who had fought in the International Brigade.

When I was 18, inspired by Gearge Orwell’s book ‘Homage to Catalonia" I went to Spain on a motorcycle – to Barcelona- where I discovered Gaudi, as well as what life was like under the regime of Franco. The people were so poor but absolutely wonderful – open, hospitable, kind. It confirmed my view that I wanted to be Spanish!! Later on Joanna and I bought a small house in Gualchos, a small village in Andalucia – it was one of the best things we ever did. Some of my most influential films are by Luis Bunuel especially the early documentary "Las Hurdes: Tierra sin pan," the surrealist ones "L’Age D’or "Un Chien Andalou", and above all "Los Olvidados" and "Viridiana" Our daughter Paloma is named after the white pigeon in "Viridiana"! I think "Viridiana ‘ has in some ways heavily influnced the content in "Family Ties".